Re: Pet Peeves in Characterization

[greaser4life]

I'm really not sure if I'm doing this right, but to answer my pet peeves about characters POV...I would have to say that Darry is always put out as either a complete jerk, or too caring and sappy. I believe that many people dont really know Darry all that well, but in order to get to know the characters, you must really read, and understands S.E. Hintons writing style, so I'm sure everyone knows that she is a character writer, and knows her characters, so we should know them too the best we can.......right?

[Keira]

I agree with you, greaser4life. A lot of fanfic authors who are just starting out, or jump the gun before getting to know the characters well will make that mistake for sure. I received an email from SE Hinton yesterday in which we were discussion fanfiction as a whole, and she agrees with all of us on that point, saying:

"... although I do appreciate the good ie stay in character, no writing yourself into the stories, writing the best"

So, if anything, write in character for the sake of Susie Hinton

[Tensleep]

Dude, I just had a "Do it for Susie!" moment...And I thought you all should know

See ya in the funny papers!!!
Tens

[Keira]

Hahaha, that's awesome.

Now, I don't know if this has been brought up yet or not, but I came up with another character pet peeve that I have come to realize in the last few days. Not turning a character OC, not having a subtle personality trait change over a period of time... no, not these, but, having a major personality change come mid-story, with no sufficient rhyme or reason.

I have come across a few stories in which the author will throw out such a random quip or change, whatever it may be.... and then give no supporting evidence or will expect it to be worked out later on in the story. They "don't know why [so-and-so] decided to say/do this, but there will be a reason! They promise!" Nothing more aggravating than that.

That also goes for insisting that a character would react a certain way, when the vast majority of people disagree. An overwhelming idea doesn't necessarily overrule anything, but it should at least tell the author that they might need to rethink what they wrote, or how they wrote it.

[theinsider]

As for myself, I have this total beef where Dally winds up being this guy that is so tough as nails that you could destroy everything he had ever known or loved and he would scarcely blink. He does have a few weaknesses, people, now matter how hard he tries to keep them hidden!

On the contrary, I have to agree with someone who mentioned this early on, I don't remember who it was. I've read too many fanfics where this girl waltzs in and, all of a sudden, Dally totally undergoes this epic transformation to this good guy who will never commit another crime as long as he lived, because he loves her. Yeah, true love might conquer all, but Dally's like a rock, folks. You see death and destruction in Manhattan and one miraculous girl isn't going to reverse that.
Although, admittedly, I did write something like that about Jack Sparrow once... *blushes*

[Tensleep]

Those are some good points, I really see myself thinking along the same lines as theinsider.

Honestly, any girl who would love Dallas would have to love him the way he is. Changing him isn't going to change things in the relationship and if he really loved a gal, he might tone it down a bit, but there would still be Dallas. He's seen and done too much to fall in love, renounce his ways and fit into society. I can't see any of them changing like that for a girl, not even our dear "Saint Soda". Two-Bit would still steal for fun, Dallas would still fight and swear, Steve would still drag race and Soda would still love fights. Those are base expressions of their characters. You take out one, which leads to two and so forth...

And when it happens in a story with just the blink of an eye because he's been written as in love...I dunno. I stick away from romances in this section for that very reason.

That's my strange ramble of the day

[texaskid]

Yeah i kinda agree with all of them especially Dally. I mean it's like that one country song "Why, why, why." by billy currington. I don't know if any of you've heard it but it's about a girl loving the way a guy is and then suddenly wanting him to change. If a girl loves Dallas then it's gotta be because of the way he is not the potential for anything.
don't know if that made any sense but hey it's what i thought

[theinsider]

I got another one!

I really really hate it when Darry suddenly becomes this big bad brother whose only function in the story is to set down rules and make Pony's life miserable.

And I also hate it when every other word that comes out of Dally's mouth can be concidered offensive. He didn't swear THAT much in the books.

Oh, and any one of the gang going emo drives me up the wall, too. I can't see any member of the gang cutting themself. Ever ever ever ever. Ever.

Sorry, that sorta ended up being three instead of one...

[Keira]

I can't see any of them becoming cutters either, but at the same time it happens to the best of people. I still think he could go through a depressed time, and I hate to admit it, but there have been a couple of well written Pony-cutting-himself stories, where the events of the book have thrown his life through a loop, but in the end everything works out alright. But, still... that genre of writing should definitely be avoided for The Outsiders, lol.

I can't remember if or when this was mentioned, but I also can't stand it when the only place the gang hangs out is in the Curtis's living room, the kitchen, or Buck Merrill's. Ponyboy, Soda, and Darry never went to Buck's, so that doesn't always work, and what a boring life to stay home all day every day and sit on the couch. Man, that'd get old fast. The guys have better lives than that, and should act like it.

[theinsider]

Yes, totally! A lot of people forget that the gang has lives outside of the Curtis' living room... even if they aren't good ones, they're still lives. Does that make any sense? ;D

[hopelesslydevoted]

I pretty much agree with the above...but I am on a roll with these late night rants, so here are the OOCs I absolutely LOATHE

1.) Saint Sodapop/Disgustingly Over-Emotional Sodapop/Totally Easygoing Calm "Nothing EVER Bothers Me" Sodapop : Ok, he had ONE break-down, ONE (which was completely acceptable may i add, everyone deserves to breakdown when they've had too much of w/e) but WHY are all the Sodapop's out there suddenly calling everybody "baby" and "honey" and tearing up at the slightest mention of violence or as soon as Pony and Darry start arguing? Or, how Soda suddenly never does anything wrong, and how he's always the one that rescues poor little Mary-Sue from some unnecessary Soc rape/family or boyfriend abuse scene b/c , of course, he is a perfect knight in shining armor. Isn't it established that he has a wild side as well as a tender side? Didn't Pony say he wasn't all innocent or that he never lost a fight; Soda can be dangerous as well as caring and that is why Soda has always appealed to me. Maybe its b/c Soda's reckless and wild side wasn't heavily portrayed in TO is why we have all of these sappy Soda's popping up. But really, Soda DOES have another side to him, and that side is often completely ignored b/c an author wants to have the gorgeous caring Soda sleep with/fall in love with their Mary-Sue ( **cough***self-insert***cough***). Those dual personalities of Soda have always intrigued me, they are why he is one my favorite characters) and I think people need to remember that Soda actually has the potential to be dangerous, wild, and irrational at times.

2.) I have trouble believing that Steve is a complete jerk 100% of the time. Just b/c Pony says he doesn't like him sometimes doesn't mean hes all bad. I think STeve is actually a complex character (I'm writing a story that shows some of that complexity....like why he seems like a jerk all the time) and i get really annoyed when I see people portray his as a bad-guy just so (sometimes) a MS can get on Pony's good side and get in his pants

3.) Ok. Darry is not abusive. He doesn't yell and scream w/o reason (hes SMART rememeber)
O Yes...and while im at it...the Curtis brothers arent sexually attracted to each other

$.) Dally is NOT Sodapop....I cant stand when i read all these "i cant believe how much I managed to change the sold hearted Dallas Winston" deals..... do the words "If you're tough like me, you wont get hurt" ring a bell? If a girl were to fall in love with our fabulous hood, she'd have to love him exactly how he is, and if by chance Dally manages to fall back, he would realize that she does love him how he is and he doesnt have to change for her


sorry, i realize that sounded unnecessarily mean.... i was trying to be mean i was just annoyed.....late night rant....wow

[texaskid]

i believe i said something like that about dally hopelesslydevoted but it's good to know there are others who see it as well. And i do agree with you on steve. If Soda likes him so much then he can't be a total jerk.

[Keira]

That was perfectly said, hopelesslydevoted. Sometimes you gotta be mean to get the message across

I have to admit, Steve's complexity baffles me. I have a hard time writing him, and so when I do I have to concentrate on not-so-complex ideas regarding him, lol. I think I've only ever written one chapter from his POV ever. I ought to give that a look again and see how wrong I got it, lol.

But really, if you're going to write the characters into your own story, PLEASE at least try and get their personalities down. Don't tweak them -- they shouldn't be tweakable. We liked them because of how they were in the book, not because of how you butter them up with an MS and bring out the lovely, caring, doting side of them. *Snickers at the thought of lovey-dovey Dally's*

In all honesty, I'd be terrified if I ran into Dallas Winston. I love him, but I'd probably be afraid.

[paisley51090]

I agree with akanechan. I too can tolerate Pony being depressed, sad, etc. but when you throw in drugs and cutting and all that stuff, it gets to be out of character. I'll admit, i was guilty of that in my first outsider fanfic. It wasn't until later that i realized he probably wouldn't do that. I also agree about abusive darry. There's a difference between hitting someone once and being abusive. Being abusive is hurting someone all the time, and obviously ( i don't know if i spelled that right) he doesn't do that.

As far as my own pet peeves go, i don't have one that hasn't already been discussed.

[cooroo]

I agree with all of the Peeves that have already been mentioned, but the Steve-being-a-totally-evil-jerk plot really gets to me. I found a story the other day where he jumped Pony. That was just plain wrong, in my opinion.
Abusive Darry... I cannot express how much I hate that. He loves Pony and Soda so much - can't people see how awful he felt after hitting Pony?

Now, one more that really gets to me, that hasn't been mentioned yet (I don't think), is the Socs being the Ultimate Evil. They're always jumping greasers or attacking girls (don't even get me started on the last one), never having just a good time with friends, hanging out. I mean, the whole point of the book (ok, one of the points) was that the other guy is human, too. Randy and Cherry show that. A Soc's ambition in life isn't to rid the world of greasers.